Rue Morgue Podcast

Episode 025: THE VERDICT – THE DEVIL’S REJECTS

on July 8, 2011 | 48 Comments

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Recently on the Rue Morgue Podcast, Rob Zombie’s The Devil’s Rejects was thrown before the mercy of the Horror Court.

Prosecuting the film on behalf of the crown was yours truly. Bravely defending it was Charlie Lawton from the Toronto Underground Cinema.

But it was up to you, the listeners, a.k.a. the judge, jury and executioners to determine its fate, to decide whether or not The Devil’s Rejects is GUILTY or NOT GUILTY of being a load of bloody codswallop!

So listen up. The verdict may take you by surprise!

:- FDBK

And here’s a few links you’ll need if you wanna play along at home with this week’s episode:

The Original Post.

Shlogg’s Horror Blog.

Rob Zombie’s Woolite Commercial.

To have one of your letters read on an upcoming edition of the Rue Morgue Podcast, send an email to letters @ ruemorgueradio.com.

To listen to the episode, use the embedded player or click HERE
(or ‘Right Click’ to save to your hard drive).
To subscribe in iTunes, use the following URL:

http://www.ruemorgueradio.com/RMpodcast/rss.xml.

Tags: devil's reject, devil's rejects, horror court, Rob Zombie

Responses to Episode 025: THE VERDICT – THE DEVIL’S REJECTS

  1. Dark Mark says:

    A travesty of justice.

  2. Dark Mark says:

    Now more than ever I agree that Cummings is just aping Tarantino and he isn’t worthy of kissing his feet. Please don’t speed yourself up again FB, I have loathed that since growing up with Pinky and Perky, like nails on a black board…I mean chalk board.

  3. Evil_Otto says:

    A fine decision by a well hung jury.

  4. Robert Black says:

    The jury wasn’t hung high enough after that verdict. An appeal is in order.

  5. Feedback says:

    Agreed with Robert Black and Dark Mark.

    As for the chipmunk voice…..I’ve found a new toy and I’m gonna play with it! (Alright, maybe I won’t.)

    But listen. I’m very disappointed at this. I wanted to be the Johnny Cochran of Horror. But now I’m the Lionel Hutz. :(

    I need to find a new career.

  6. Evil_Otto says:

    Don’t put that briefcase in the closet yet, Feedback!

    Regardless of this how this trial turned out (in this case, a vindication of the misunderstood auteur Rob Zombie and the fine Woolite family of products), Horror Court appears to be a runaway hit! Keep ‘em coming, very entertaining stuff-…I can’t wait to see who’s next on the docket.

  7. Nick English says:

    All I can say is Rob Zombie and Casey Anthony should pop open a champagne bottle and clink glasses.

    But remember: “Not guilty” doesn’t necessarily mean “innocent”.

  8. Feedback says:

    Miscarriages of justice appear to be all the rage these days.

  9. The Gore-met says:

    OK, I’m way late to this party, but I’m compelled to say that I find Zombie’s enthrallment with his white trash characters masturbatory and totally off-putting. This is why I don’t like his films. and it begins with House of 1.000 Corpses. To me, The Devil’s Rejects is a piece of shit because it exalts irredeemable scumbag characters. In The Texas Chain Saw Massacre, the villains are what they are because that’s what they are, they aren’t self-aware as the characters are in Zombie’s first two films. In other words, they don’t know that they are psychos. In that regard, I find Zombie’s films dishonest because the director is too interested in celebrating qualities in his characters that he thinks are there. The Firefly clan are not anti-heroes a la Snake Plissken (the consummate anti-hero), they’re just poorly-drawn caricatures I don’t buy.

  10. Feedback says:

    Gore-Met. Why do you do this to me? Obviously I coulda used you a LONG time ago…..

  11. Maggot Brain says:

    I was very entertained by the Horror Court and felt dissapointed in myself in that I could have helped you close that vote gap there. The interview was well done, too. Sorry, I don’t buy Zombie’s bit that his actors just happened to be auditioning for the movie. Maybe for one or two of those roles, but EVERY SINGLE CHARACTER in Devil’s Rejects is played by someone from a cult film of the 70′s and 80′s. It’s extremely obvious and takes you out of the movie.

  12. Corby Daniel says:

    I can’t believe how this turned out. i’m used to being surrounded by people who are wrong all the time, but I thought that’s just because I live in Texas. I wouldn’t expect the same insanity on the RM boards. A travesty.

  13. Feedback says:

    The condolences are appreciated. It’s painful to bear witness to such a perversion of truth but sometimes justice is a cruel mistress.

    And for the record, I vastly overstated my enthusiasm for that WOOLITE commercial.

  14. Feedback says:

    I got a great email from JAMAL which he’s given me permission to repost here:

    I listened to the Rue Morgue podcast where you debated The Devil’s Rejects, I voted Not Guilty, but guilty for every other Rob Zombie film except Werewolf Women Of The SS.

    After listening, I thought I’d talk a bit about why I voted not guilty. I think one other person mentioned that the film in the end was entertaining, the other thing is that I really liked in this film that there was more going on, where in House Of 1000 Corpses, there wasn’t much going on and it even still didn’t make any sense (I’m refering to that scene near the end where the surviving female character finds this room with all these weird looking creatures or whatever are watching TV or something and some huge dude with an axe chaser her around for a bit).

    Rejects had OTHER interesting characters in it, I enjoyed the sub plot where William Forsythe hires a pair of assassins to find the family of killers and take them out. So just for things like that, I thought the film should be left alone.

    I didn’t think that Rob Zombie should be compared to Quentin Tarantino so much because Quentin is an AMAZING writer and I believe innovator in CULT/Horror cinema (remember cult and exploitation is to horror as Fantasy is to Sci-Fi, therefore should be discussed on the Rue Morgue podcast).

    Quentin Tarantino like my FAVORITE director, Tim Burton are examples of people who started off as hard core fans of the genre and then took their inspirations to make innovative and classic films, each of which is a TRIBUTE (as oppose to a rip off) of the films they were inspired by.

    Mr. Zombie doesn’t quite fall into this category because his films don’t offer anything creative or innovative, there are no brilliantly classic signatures like there are in Burton and Tarantino films. Zombie’s films are for the casual horror film goer who doesn’t really know anything about the genre or filmmaking at all, they just go with what’s big and popular right now (this is why the Halloween remakes made so much money, because too many people who don’t care or don’t know any better went to see the films).

    Now, as for Werewolf Women Of The SS. Remember that’s a fake trailer for Grindhouse, the film works because it’s short and sweet and showcases all the great qualities for a TRAILER of that genre, it’s fun, dark and faced paced, and stars Udo Kier, I liked seeing Nicolas Cage in it, but really I like it for Udo Kier!! If there was a full length film for this movie…perhaps I wouldn’t like it so much because Rob can’t take something like this and stretch it out into a decently delivered film that does justice to the great performers (like Udo) that are in it.

    Before I end this, I also wanna touch on the mini debate about The Dark Knight. That film (if you want to call it that) SUCKS DEAD DONKEY BALLS. Because it is a complete INSULT to anything and everything that made Batman a great and brilliant gothic horror fantasy story. The whole point of Nolan’s Batman movies was to disregard what we know and love about the Batman story and characters and present it in a real life modern setting, with logical outcomes for the series of simply unfortunate events that occur. FUCK THAT. Batman rules because like any great horror or fantasy story it doesn’t bother with real life, it declairs that in the world where Gotham City exists there is some crazy, dark, mystical, and at times supernatural shit that goes on. This is what Batman IS truly about. Nolan and his team had no right to fuck with that.

    The only films that truly brought Batman to life using all the gothic horror and fantasy influences that it was originally based on where Tim Burton’s Batman and Batman Returns. They used plots and outcomes directly from the comic books and without hesitation put in all the elements that were essential to the Batman story and characters and ultimately produced what I believe to be 2 of the great gothic horror films ever made, with influence by “The Man Who Laughs”, and “Repulsion” and apperances by horror icons like Michael Gough, Jack Nicholson, Christopher Walken (his character was named after the actor from Nosferatu, how can any horror fan dare to talk shit about that), and Michael Keaton.

    Those 2 films make no mistake in being the only 2 true Batman films (with creator Bob Kane on set to approve the process).

    Nolan’s movies are the opposite of this and therefore have no respect for Batman or Bob Kane, and any true horror fan and any true Batman fan would immediatley dismiss Nolan’s films as a bunch of utter bullshit.

    Thanks,
    JAMAL

  15. Feedback says:

    Alright, thank YOU Jamal for a kick arse manifesto. Loads of interesting and great points in there.

    I thought perhaps the DARK KNIGHT would be too far off course for us to take to the HORROR COURT for the next episode, but your comments have made me reconsider.

  16. ZIMERMAAAAAAN! says:

    fucking hell.

    its multiple account time…

  17. Feedback says:

    I agree. I mean, that’s obviously what Rob Zombie was doing to influence the vote!

  18. Evil_Otto says:

    I see a lot of different reasons given here for disliking RZ’s work. And I agree, to a point, with some of them: his dialogue needs work, he wears his horror inspirations on his sleeve a bit too much at times, etc.

    I think what I like about his films is the visual energy and the fact that he refuses to give his audience a “safe word” if you will. There’s a true sense of danger and well, horror to the proceedings. His violence isn’t “fun.” The viewer is repulsed, shocked and has no idea what is going to happen next.

    Regarding the Gore-Met’s point about RZ romanticizing the Firefly family as anti-heroes, I think this is very deliberate manipulation on RZ’s part. He’s making the viewer question the whole thought process behind the characters we choose to elevate to anti-hero status. As horror fans, we do it all the time. I suppose being troubled by The Devil’s Rejects is an adequate response. I found the film especially effective in this regard.

    For people to say that RZ has no talent or that he doesn’t have any imagination as a filmmaker is a reductive arguement. I think the fact that he can generate this much debate demonstrates that he can get under people’s skin and get them talking. Otherwise, they’d just write him off as shite and quietly move on.

    That being said, I think Rob Zombie has yet to make a film that truly delivers on the flashes of potential in his films to date. One day, RZ will make a horror film so mind-blowingly horrific/awesome that you will weep into your popcorn.

    And then, the Night of the Zombie will truly be upon thee.

  19. Feedback says:

    Yeah, he’s promising alright. He went from TDR to making TWO HALLOWEEN REMAKES – easily the mark of an inspired force in horror. Wow. The genre has never looked better.

  20. Evil_Otto says:

    I wholeheartedly agree that the state of horror as a genre is afflicted by the studios’ preference to rehash past properties rather than put something new on the table.

    RZ and many other directors ARE pitching new concepts and ideas to the studios…and they’re being refused funding/the almighty greenlight.

    The thought process behind taking these remake assignments is likely: 1. to earn enough money to throw some dollars behind that dazzling new film idea that is closer to the heart, or 2. to earn enough box office with the remake that the execs can be convinced to fund that smashing original idea for a new film.

    Yes, I suppose the directors could say fuck off when the execs ask them to helm a remake and head off to the bushes with their HD camera. Or they could make a deal with the devil.

    Do all of these directors who are taking on assignments like Mothers’ Day, A Nightmare on Elm Street, I Spit on Your Grave, etc. all deserve to be put up against the wall for making that deal? I’m not so sure.

    Either way, I think RZ’s next film is going to The Lords of Salem, which isn’t a remake. Shall I save everybody a seat? Uhh…nevermind…

  21. Feedback says:

    Well….at least ROB ZOMBIE was given total creative control over EL SUPERBEASTO – and of course, we all know what an absolute masterpiece that turned into.

    Actually though – he was given ONE chance to make a live action horror film PURELY of his own accord —–

    —-and he chose to do a WOOLITE commercial.

    Weird huh? Then again, he’s a brilliant artist and I’m just a pleeb so what the fuck do I know?

  22. Evil_Otto says:

    Settle down Feedback…

    I said he had flashes of potential, not that he was a brilliant artist…and my opinions weren’t a dogmatic defense of his filmography.

    I hope I’m misinterpreting your tone in that last line, but I certainly wasn’t personally attacking anybody who has a different opinion on the matter.

  23. FEEDBACK says:

    Evil…I wasn’t referring to anything you said with the ‘pleeb’ thing. Jeez…..do you think the world revolves around you! ;)

    And yes – I know you’re not doggedly championing him….BUT you still see far more worth in him than I do.

    Sorry….

    This is a director responsible for the following:

    1. A totally inept debut.

    2. A quazi sequel that….well….you know how I feel.

    3. A pointless and uninspired remake of HALLOWEEN. I repeat – a remake of HALLOWEEN (artistic credibilty = hurting at this point.)

    4. A SEQUEL to said uninspired remake.

    5. EL SUPERBEASTO. (The defense rests on that.)

    Culminating with….

    A FUCKING WOOLITE commercial!

    Come on. Enough is enough. When are you ZOMBIE apologists gonna wake up?

  24. Evil_Otto says:

    Okay, that’s a relief! (re: the pleeb thing). :)

    Admittedly, EL SUPERBEASTO and WOOLITE are painful blows to the cause. There’s a lot riding on THE LORDS OF SALEM…either the RZ apologists will wake up and smell the coffee…or we will continue dreaming our dreamy little dream!

  25. Feedback says:

    But what’s behind the dreamy little dream? Is it because fans are so intoxicated by his music that they give him a pass with the dodgy flicks? I’ve never paid attention to his music so perhaps I’m immune to that spell.

    Anyway – you’re right. LORDS OF SALEM has to be the final word. If that blows, then I will no longer tolerate any more Zombie apologies. I will strike all cognition of the man and his work from my psychic record (and permanently avoid ANYONE else who doesn’t follow suit!)

    But if it’s good – I’ll be the first to admit so.

  26. Scotty says:

    An important decision, I think. When two counselors present their cases this well, this thoroughly, and all of their points hit home, it becomes about something bigger –– the power of film itself –– and “not guilty” makes the most sense.

    As I said before, we go in expecting so much these days, and have over the many years we’ve watched films, and we hold each film to a complex standard. But when a film just has a go at the audience like RZ’s films and in the end presents a flawed anthem to horror, we need to accept it for what it is like an exasperating friend.

    No one has to declare it a masterpiece, or even GOOD in the traditional sense, but it can’t be ignored and that should stand for something. So many films play by the rules these days and are easily forgotten.

    Great fun, this. More please!

  27. Stu White says:

    This has been a fascinating discussion that I’ve enjoyed following. I’m not a particular fan of Zombie’s work in general, and I think The Devil’s Rejects in particular is riddled with horrible weaknesses. But I’m not inclined to write it off entirely as excrement, because after consideration (prompted, as I mentioned earlier, by Mr. Lawton’s defence) there seems to be enough of a directorial intelligence at work for me to put this down as a genuine artistic work. It’s not very successful, but it is, I believe, an expression of an idiosyncratic point of view. Whatever the film’s flaws (and there are many), Zombie is expressing a distinct – and relentlessly nihilistic – worldview (as clumsy as it is, I think the chicken-fucking scene emphatically emphasizes that point). Having a vision, and honestly attempting to express it, are the pre-requisites for genuine art. And so I’d distinguish TDR from hack-work like the re-makes of The Fog or One Missed Call because I think Zombie has an agenda, rather than merely a need for a paycheck. Therefore, as I suggested before, an honourable failure.

    I believe I better understand why Mr. Andrews referred so frequently to Tarantino’s work (you made explicit in the second podcast what had been implicit in the first) but I’d like to raise a further point on the issue. Tarantino is one of the most gifted American filmmakers working today. He’s a particularly strong screenwriter. Mr. Andrews was not wrong to suggest that Tarantino’s handling of character is more nuanced, or his dialogue far more polished, than Zombie’s. But that rather misses the point. The question posed was not, “Is The Devil’s Rejects a modern classic?” or even, “Is The Devil’s Rejects a very good horror movie.” And it certainly was not, “Is Rob Zombie a better director or screenwriter than Quentin Tarantino?” Had any of those been the terms, I expect Mr. Andrews would have carried the day quite easily. In all of these posts, there were relatively few people who expressed unambiguous admiration for the film. But Mr. Lawton convincingly argued that there was some merit in the film, and some merit was adequate to allow the TDR to escape the charge of being utterly without value.

    For my part, I associate TDR not with Tarantino but with Alexandre Aja’s Haute Tension. Aja’s effort is far more assured and technically proficient, but its last act reveal not only makes nonsense of the film’s internal logic, it also flashes a deeply ugly attitude toward lesbians, if not women in general (I think you can argue the latter, but that’s beside the point). Both films configure human relations as bestial, if not insectile. I don’t much care for either director’s subsequent output (curiously, my strongest memory from Aja’s The Hills Have Eyes remake was the scene swiped from True Romance) but both The Devil’s Rejects and Haute Tension are the most personal and authentic movies either man has made. I don’t have to like them to acknowledge that these works have more value for a discussion of modern horror cinema than any number of j-horror remakes or tepid PG13 multiplex fodder.
    I’m looking forward to future instalments of this series, and can only hope they’re as good.

  28. Feedback says:

    First of all, great posts Scotty and Stu White.

    I’m delighted that so many thoughtful and intelligent folks have dialed into the Rue Morgue Podcast.

    Moving forward on this….

    In future cases, the charge will be more pointed and specific than merely ‘Guilty or Not Guilty’ of being a load of crap.

    Someone pointed this out – and I have to agree – it’s not really fair to many films to do that.

    Of course, I believe some films are absolutely beneath contempt and would deserve little else – but I have to concede that as much as I disliked it, the Rob Zombie movie deserves a ‘little’ more respect.

    I could’ve perhaps charged it with ‘Guilty or Not Guilty’ of being a Quentin Tarantino forgery. Then perhaps I could’ve presented a more convincing case.

    Anyway – it’s all stuff to consider when we plan the next one.

    But I wanna thank everyone for participating in this, ESPECIALLY the Devil’s Rejects fans because even though I come off as a stubborn bastard – I’m not a stubborn FUCKING bastard! And many of your points were not lost on me!

    So there you have it – that’s the CLOSEST I’ll ever fucking say to anything positive about TDR!

    Also – it occurs to me that some of you may have blogs….etc or may write about films in other forums. If so, drop me a line with the link:

    stuart @ ruemorgueradio.com

    I wanna investigate.

  29. JAYSAW says:

    WORSE use of ‘freebird’ EVER!

    I wont even get into my views on Tarantino ;D, but i feel Rob Zombie needs to stop putting everyone he admires in his films and really put more effort into the script and character’s. He deserves a GUILTY verdict, but i think he should just be put in the stocks and have rottern fruit thrown at him.

  30. Uncle Bill says:

    Some of this conversation made me wanna puke. The whole idea of taste vs. subjectivity- completely ridiculous. It’s all subjective… the thing you’re trying to objectify is that someone can decide the subjectivity of something like a piece of art upon repeated viewings – which is ridiculous. All you’re really doing is just saying that if your subjective opinion is reinforced a billion times, it becomes objective…which it doesn’t, it just becomes your particular reinforced line of thinking. If that is the foundation that you’re using to judge these films, then no wonder you sincerely believe you’re right.

  31. Feedback says:

    UB. You got my point ALL wrong mister.

    I didn’t in any way indicate that by REPEATED viewings of a film that your “SUBJECTIVE” opinion becomes “OBJECTIVE.”

    What I meant about ‘taste’ is that your overall understanding of a work of art can be informed by experience and understandings of OTHER works, knowing how it fits into tradition, knowing how it contrasts to other works….etc. Essentially, just knowing more about the complex interplay of the dynamics involved.

    I think the analogy between an art aficionado who can detect a forgery based on the ‘brush strokes’ of a painting has merit in Rob Zombie’s case, as I’ve illustrated in this discussion.

    Rob Zombie attempted to reproduce the fine brush strokes of another artist. That’s simple.

    And while I’m not an art expert – or even a horror film expert (sorry, they wouldn’t let me study at the Kentucky Institute of Horror-ology – I had to do a major in African Women’s Studies at the local community college instead), I know ENOUGH about the genre to definitively judge that Rob Zombie’s THE DEVIL’S REJECTS is a forgery!

    [Glad I made you wanna puke though! But are you sure it was the discussion and not that bucket of greasy KFC gadgets you were no doubt guzzling?]

  32. Fallingtower says:

    When it comes to Rob Zombie I’ve always been overall unimpressed….but to be honest I like his movies more than his shitty music. Which isn’t saying much.

    Just look at his lyrics…sophmoric and moronic.
    The music itself is quite polished…not a note out of place.

    Back to the movies…yeah they aren’t great, but they are better than most of the garbage they show on late night pay cable.

    Sherry Moon is the perfect metaphor for RZ filmaking…doesn’t look bad, but really at it’s core, untalented, retarded and shrill.

    Still…I like Rob Zombie, because he’s not Eli Roth.

    Feedback, I know you love the QT, but fuck-sheesh. what’s you take on him and his beloved (and major motion picture starring!) Bear Jew?

    If you had to pick between Roth and Zombie, who’d you take?

    That would be an interesting topic.

  33. Feedback says:

    I think I defend Tarantino vigilantly because he’s the most ingenious filmmaker of his generation – and even though by industry standards and the film community at large, he’s considered a legendary talent – he gets a rough ride from a large portion of hardcore genre fans because they mistakenly position the familiar elements of his work (i.e. all the bits and bobs he homages and/or rips off from other films) as his only indentifiable features.

    As I’ve argued on the show…
    And even more intensely HERE:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg-PjW_soTo

    …there’s a HELL of a lot more to Tarantino than simply those observable traits.

    His narrative structures, his unique voice and poetry of his dialogue, his sense of dramatic structure, his manipulation of audience expectations, these are amongst his most impressive artistic attributes and that qualities that firmly set him apart from other filmmakers of his generation.

    ALSO – we live in a culture that denigrates genius while propping up mediocrity on a pedestal. And I think Tarantino suffers from that.

    NOW – I’m not enamored with EVERYTHING Tarantino – for instance the whole ELI ROTH situation. In a weird way, I think he’s a big fish in a small pond, if you can imagine the Hollywood party scene as a ‘small pond.’

    Tarantino hobnobs with lesser talents – and sometimes his work and reputation suffers as a result. He also comes off as rather wonky and slightly bezerk in a lot of interview situations. As for his acting….well….that’s a whole other line of discussion.

    But at the end of the day, he’s a fucking genius – and with that goes a certain amount of eccentricity so he gets a pass in my book.

  34. Fallingtower says:

    Hey Feedback,

    I’ve been a fan of Tarantino ever since I saw Reservoir Dogs at a little un-air conditioned art house movie theatre.

    I walked out stunned by it’s brilliance.

    Listening to QT talk makes me wonder if he’s an idiot savant or a straight up genius. He’s fucking weird…I’ll leave it at that.

    I don’t know how I got off Zombie topic.

    But like you Feedback…I fucking hate Eli Roth and all he stands for.

    I don’t know why I’m kinda defending Mr. Zombie, other than he seems like a nice guy. Unlike Roth.

    I listened to a few RZ DVD commentaries and I found him humble, honest and unpretentious. Again…not Roth.

    RZ basically admits in the commentary tracks that I listened to, that he is a total amateur.

    Still..no excuse…his movies aren’t very good.

    If I would’ve voted in the poll…I’d have to say guilty. But guilty of a lesser charge. A crime of incompetence, rather than one of Rothian douchebaggery.

  35. Feedback says:

    That’s the part of lacerating Zombie’s movies I don’t like – I think Rob Zombie seems like a decent bloke – and those are in short supply.

    Then again, it’s important to separate the man from the art to some degree in order to arrive at an honest assessment. And that goes both ways – it’s important to recognize the worthy efforts of unlikeable characters too.

  36. Fallingtower says:

    The truly sad thing is characters like Ewe Boll, Eli Roth and Rob Zombie are given gobs of cash to turn out worthless, forgettable trash. While folks like John Carpenter who could take half the budget and turn out classics.

    (Though I think JC might be fried)

  37. Feedback says:

    Someone told me that THE WARD was like watching your grandfather pissing himself.

  38. Scotty says:

    Heh, great line.

  39. @Feedback: I finally heard the Horror Court verdict yesterday and, while I was pleased to hear my email read on the air, I took exception to what you called the “limited” viewpoint I had of Tarantino’s work. I didn’t want to threadjack the TDR discusion, so I’ll elaborate here.

    It’s the sheer GLEE that Tarantino takes in stealing ideas and images that many of us find so infuriating. QT is quoted in Joe Bob Briggs’ book “Profoundly Disturbing” as saying “I steal from every single movie ever made. I love it. If my work has anything, it’s that I’m taking this from this and that from that and mixing them together and if people don’t like them then tough titty, don’t go and see it, all right?” So I don’t. He can steal whatever shit he wants, and I’ll honor my end of the bargain and not see his films. (Upon reflection, Tarantino and I seem to have a fairly stable relationship…)

    Frankly, your “colors in the pallette” argument for his constant stealing is hardly an argument at all. It’s just a fancier way of saying “Because Quentin Tarantino is an ARTIST.” I find it a vague, dismissive, and exclusionary statement; hell, Michael Bay has a”pallette” as well. His “colors” are “explosions”, “military footage”, and “size 3 actresses in size 1 camisoles”.

    The other problem I have with QT is that I feel that he eclipses his own work. He’s known as a “rock star director” and it’s so true- he becomes bigger than his films. (Quick quiz: envision Martin Scorsese. Now envision QT. A lot clearer of an image, isn’t it?) You mentioned separating the artist from the work: I have never had a harder time with Tarantino. This clown can’t stay in the background. Every time I watch one of his movies, I feel like he’s right there next to me on the couch/theater, asking me ad nauseum, “Do you like it? Do you like it? What do you think? It’s pretty cool, isn’t it?” This might be my fault because I keep reading interviews to learn more about him and understand the appeal, and I always close the book wanting him to just shut the hell up. (“Kill Bill Vol. 1″ pissed me off so much. There he is gabbing away in, um, “Ganforia” about his “great relationship with the MPAA”. Yeah, well when you film your bloodiest scene in B/W, Quentin, of COURSE the MPAA will love you.)

    And on the subject of Quentin going away, I’m so sick of this happening in my favorite DVD stores:
    Me: “Cool! ‘The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly’ on DVD! Wait, what does this blurb say?”
    Blurb: “THIS FILM IS SO AWESOME, MAN! – Quentin Tarantino”
    Me: “AAAAAGGHHHHHH!!!”

    So those are my problems with Quentin Tarantino. I’m not out to change anyone’s mind; this is just a difference of opinion.

    And in closing, this does not apply to all of his films. “Pulp Fiction” was enjoyable, and I honestly enjoyed “Jackie Brown”. Its dialogue, its plot twists… everything you like about QT, Feedback, I liked too. Admittedly, maybe I hadn’t watched enough blaxploitation to know what he was ripping off, but that was by far his best film.

    -The Gil-Monster

  40. Fallingtower says:

    Yeah I heard the same thing about The Ward, but again…Carpenter just directed. He didn’t have any other input on the movie.

    Really, I fear JC has lost his muse.

    But I’d like to see him get his own project, just to prove me wrong.

    Maybe a western…he’s never got to do his western.

    Snake Plisken or Jack Burton goes west.

  41. FEEDBACK says:

    Gil Monster.

    1. All artists steal.

    2. I think I made a case for Tarantino’s artistic credibility beyond this notion that all he does is steal. Your comments don’t indicate that you heard a syllable of the argument.

    3. ” (Quick quiz: envision Martin Scorsese. Now envision QT. A lot clearer of an image, isn’t it?)”

    Er…..NO. I was a devotee of Scorsese long before Tarantino ever made films – and I’ve seen more interviews with Scorsese than Tarantino. So how are you deriving this assumption?

    Anyway, I get that you don’t like the man and that’s fine – and if it gets in the way of the films for you, then that’s alright too. You’re entitled.

    But just for the record, your comments here do not form a sufficient rebuttal to MY comments and you have neglected to respond to my specific points in favour of Tarantino’s work.

    So if this was in the HORROR COURT, I’d raise an OBJECTION which the judge would no doubt reply with…..

    …..SUSTAINED!

  42. Bleach Sancho says:

    Listening to this, it reminded me of something… this movie in particular is about the only horror film that made me sad, not really for the characters, but just the way that the whole family gets changed around from the first film. I actually enjoyed House of 1,000 Corpses, but not as a smart, or interesting. I liked it only because the violence, and brutality…(how sick do i sound here?)

    Upon seeing that the family is uprooted, and forced to go on the lamb made me sad, in a disappointing sort of way. Sort of like when you take a toy from a toddler. I found the dialog to be one sided, more so than the first film as well…

    At the very end, i half-sympathized with the characters as they face their certain doom… but then i remembered the rest of the trash that came out of their mouths, and sort of cheered the police on for the first time in a long time…

  43. BKarloff23 says:

    The Ward is a far better film than say, oh, I dunno…Human Centipede. I don’t understand how you could defend that piece of shite and call Zombie’s films inept (even though RZ has made some crap, admittedly…I can’t stand H2, and not a fan of TDR, either). But anyway, I submit this: RZ’s flaws are at times more interesting than most, and portions of his films are intriguing even when not successful. The first half of the Halloween film appealed to me in an almost obsessive manner when it was released. I would prefer it to be about an original character, but I really like the take and Daeg in the role. I’m also in the apparent minority who doesn’t mind him giving work to actors he admires. I’ve always disliked that criticism.

  44. BKarloff23 says:

    Agree with Bleach regarding the complete change of the family from HO1KC (which I like as a love letter to horror, even with it’s HUGE flaws) to TDR. It doesn’t make sense.

  45. BKarloff23 says:

    And the “Grandfather pissing himself” line…cute, but only stated because Carpenter directed. The Ward is no great shakes, but it’s not a film that would be singled out as a particularly TERRIBLE film if it had a different director. We’ve come to expect more from JC, sure.

  46. Joe Cole says:

    No justice in this world.

  47. Christopher says:

    I cannot believe what I just heard ! After the mountains of evidence against ‘The Devil’s Rejects’ that far outweighed any defense given by Mr. Laughton, this was found not guilty ? I realize it was not an easy task in this case mind you, but statements like “That’s how it’s supposed to be” and “That’s why I like it” aren’t exactly arguments against the points that Mr. Feedback used to continually dissect the movie. Did any of the jury voting on this with ‘not guilty’ actually listen to the show ? I think not. Unfortunately it’s this exact mentality to defend even a poorly executed horror movie that continues to give us the glut of badly done remakes from Platinum Dunes, Michael Bay, etc.
    The last time a jury came back with a ‘not guilty’ verdict for something this badly shot led to days of rioting in Los Angeles and the star was Rodney King. Hopefully that won’t happen this time… but it should !
    Great show any way. Thanks for reading my statement on it and I hope to hear more shows like this in the future.

  48. Christopher says:

    Damn. The link to my page didn’t work since it was too long and the post went up before I could shorten it LOL

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